Debates of Sept. 17th, 2025

Finance

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, the collapsing economy is bringing down interest rates, but the financial expert does not even know what his own deficit is.

Another financial expert spoke yesterday. The Parliamentary Budget Officer said, “the deficit will absolutely be higher” because of “additional spending”. He said that he does not know what the government's fiscal anchors are because they do not exist. He says, “the labour market sucks” and “wages are not going up”.

Is this why Liberal members on the committee who heard those truth bombs threatened that the Prime Minister would fire the Parliamentary Budget Officer after 166 days?

[Mark Carney, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I do not recognize that characterization. I just appointed the Parliamentary Budget Officer, and this government does have fiscal anchors. We are going to spend less so the country can invest more. We are going to balance the operational budget in three years. We are going to have a declining level of debt. We are going to do all of that because we are building the strongest economy in the G7 for Canadian families.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Leader of the Opposition]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister made the appointment of the Parliamentary Budget Officer temporary so that he could hold a sword over his head and threaten him if he speaks the truth about the financial mess the Prime Minister has made. To a government that does not know how to count, there is nothing more terrifying than a man armed with a calculator. The Prime Minister wants to silence the Parliamentary Budget Officer from telling the truth about the fiscal mess that he has created under his watch.

Will he legalize math, make the Parliamentary Budget Officer's position permanent and tell us how big the deficit is?

[Mark Carney, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, with respect to consultations on making the Parliamentary Budget Officer's position permanent, I look forward to speaking to the Leader of the Opposition, the leader of the Bloc Québécois and the leaders of other parties in Parliament so we have a consensus on that appointment. I welcome that opportunity.

[An hon. member]

Oh, a consensus. Is that what you were looking for?

[Mark Carney, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

Yes, because this is the new spirit of collaboration that has been put forward by the member opposite.

Justice

[Yves-François Blanchet, Bloc, Beloeil—Chambly, QC]

Mr. Speaker, this is an opportunity for collaboration. In the last few hours, there has been much speculation that the government might table what will essentially be an attack on the notwithstanding clause in the Constitution, but we do not really know yet what it will contain. That said, a poll shows there is a very broad consensus in Quebec about the importance of state secularism.

Is the Prime Minister committed to respecting the right of Quebec and the provinces to invoke the notwithstanding clause, even pre-emptively?

[Mark Carney, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, one of the most important responsibilities of the Government of Canada is to defend the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms. It is up to the Supreme Court of Canada to determine whether the repeated use of the notwithstanding clause is legal. We will see what the court decides.

[Yves-François Blanchet, Bloc, Beloeil—Chambly, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the notwithstanding clause is enshrined in the 1982 Canadian Constitution, which Quebec never signed. René Lévesque included the notwithstanding clause in every one of his bills after the Constitution was signed by all of the provinces except Quebec. The Prime Minister is attacking the legacy of Pierre Elliott Trudeau.

Is he asking judges to come down harder on Quebec and do more damage to it than Pierre Elliott Trudeau did?

[Mark Carney, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, that is simply not the case. The Supreme Court of Canada will rule on the appropriate use of the notwithstanding clause. It is that straightforward.

[Yves-François Blanchet, Bloc, Beloeil—Chambly, QC]

Mr. Speaker, in 43 years, no Quebec government has ever signed the Canadian Constitution. At this point in time, the Constitution does not allow the government to attack the French language and the Quebec value of secularism the way it wants to, so it appears to be trying to hide behind the court and a government by judges. It is asking the justices to change the Canadian Constitution on its behalf.

Will the Prime Minister respect the consensus in Quebec? If he wants to open up the Constitution, I am very open to that.

[Mark Carney, Liberal, Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, there is the legislative branch and the judicial branch. The decision will be made by the Supreme Court, not by the members of Parliament from Quebec or anywhere else in Canada.

Finance

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister promised to cap spending but is now set to double the deficit. This is another broken promise, another Liberal bait and switch.

Here is what the PBO, Canada's financial watchdog, said about the PM's economic record: “the deficit will absolutely be higher”, “I don’t know that the government currently has fiscal anchors” and “the labour market sucks, wages are not going up”.

My question is this: How high will the deficit go and what is the government's fiscal guardrail?

[François-Philippe Champagne, Liberal, Minister of Finance and National Revenue]

Mr. Speaker, I am so happy to see that our Conservative colleagues are so eager to see the great budget we are going to present on November 4. This is good news for Canadians indeed. It is going to be a generational investment in the future of this nation. We are going to build our country. We are going to protect our communities. We are going to empower Canadians. We are going to build the strongest economy in the G7. We are going to build like never before. We are going to build a Canada of the 21st century because we are the true north strong and free.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

Mr. Speaker, the PBO confirmed the deficit will be higher. Reports indicate it could even push $100 billion. Canadians know that massive Liberal deficits drive inflation. They pay for it at the grocery store, as food inflation is 70% above target. As a result, 25% of households cannot afford to put food on the table.

Will the Prime Minister admit that having no fiscal anchor and doubling the deficit will only drive inflation higher?

[François-Philippe Champagne, Liberal, Minister of Finance and National Revenue]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for giving me the opportunity to share good news with the House. The rate has gone down to 2.5% today. The Bank of Canada just announced it. The Conservatives should celebrate. Consumers are celebrating. Businesses are celebrating. Canada is celebrating. One thing it tells all Canadians is that our plan is working. We are going to build the strongest economy in the G7.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Mr. Speaker, the PBO, Canada's top budget watchdog, has painted a dismal picture of the Prime Minister's economic record, saying, “the labour market sucks, wages are not going up”. It gets worse for the Prime Minister, with his big plan to split the budget into operating and capital. The PBO is not fooled by the smoke and mirrors. He said, “The bottom line of the government will not change. The international public sector standards that everyone uses to measure the deficit and levels of debt will not change.”

As it turns out, debt is debt, so can the Prime Minister tell us just how much Liberal debt he is adding to Canada's bottom line?

[Patty Hajdu, Liberal, Minister of Jobs and Families and Minister responsible for the Federal Economic Development Agency for Northern Ontario]

Mr. Speaker, in the last election, only six months ago, Canadians chose a Liberal government. They chose a Liberal government because they know they need investment. They need investment in the big projects that are going to drive great jobs all across the country. They need investment in the skills training that helps evolve the next generation of workers. They need investment in food for kids, in dental care for adults and in the many ways that our government can support Canadians.

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Mr. Speaker, however the Liberals want to try to spin their massive deficits, the top financial watchdog in the country says there is only one bottom line, and we will trust the PBO's word over 10 years of Liberal deficits any day. With the plan to split the budget, it is as if the Prime Minister has forgotten that it is all linked to the same bank account, and there is really only one taxpayer.

With the deficit set to double, let us just call a spade a spade. Will the Prime Minister admit he is really just cooking the books and hoping Canadians do not notice?

[Mélanie Joly, Liberal, Minister of Industry and Minister responsible for Canada Economic Development for Quebec Regions]

Mr. Speaker, there is good news today. The Bank of Canada has reduced the interest rate to 2.5%. This is something that all entrepreneurs and all businesses are taking note of, and obviously consumers as well.

We are focused on jobs, and we heard across the country this summer that we need to be there for businesses that are trying to pivot and adapt. That is why we put $5 billion on the table to help them. Meanwhile, we are going around the world attracting foreign direct investments because we need to build Canada strong.

Employment

[Lianne Rood, Conservative, Middlesex—London, ON]

Mr. Speaker, the Parliamentary Budget Officer, Canada's top financial watchdog, just ripped the Liberal job record, saying, “the labour market sucks, wages are not going up”. Eighty-six thousand Canadians have lost their jobs since the Liberals took office. Youth unemployment is over 14%, and Canada now has the second-highest unemployment in the G7. This is another classic Liberal bait and switch.

I have one simple question: Does the Prime Minister have the guts to admit that his so-called jobs plan has completely failed Canadians?

[Anna Gainey, Liberal, Secretary of State (Children and Youth)]

Mr. Speaker, with everything going on in the world, we understand the pressures that Canadians, particularly young Canadians, are facing. This new government is getting busy with nation-building projects, which will create quality jobs, quality careers and opportunities, in particular for youth, across this country, including 18,000 jobs during the construction of a new Darlington nuclear project in Ontario, for example, and hundreds of jobs in critical minerals and mining in Saskatchewan and British Columbia. Building the strongest economy in the G7 means more opportunities for youth and for all Canadians across the country.

Finance

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L’Érable—Lotbinière, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the Liberal Prime Minister promised to cap government spending, but he is doubling the deficit. This is another broken promise, another Liberal bait and switch.

Yesterday, the Parliamentary Budget Officer issued a scathing indictment of the latest Liberal Prime Minister's first six months in office. “The deficit will absolutely be higher”, he said. “I don't know that the government currently has fiscal anchors”, he said. He said there is no clarity, no structure.

Even the independent Parliamentary Budget Officer does not know these things. Can anyone in this government tell us how far into the Liberal red the latest Prime Minister's deficit will go?

[François-Philippe Champagne, Liberal, Minister of Finance and National Revenue]

Mr. Speaker, it is nice to see that the Conservatives are looking forward to November 4. We are looking forward to it too, because, on November 4, we will present a generational investment plan for Canada's future.

We are going to build our country. We are going to protect our communities. We are going to build the Canadian economy. Together with Canadians, we will build the strongest economy in the G7. I look forward to seeing the Conservatives vote with the government to build the country of tomorrow. Long live Canada.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L’Érable—Lotbinière, QC]

Mr. Speaker, do my colleagues know what the Parliamentary Budget Officer said about November 4?

The Parliamentary Budget Officer has confirmed that the deficit is going to be a lot higher. Reports indicate that it could reach as high as $100 billion. Canadians know that massive Liberal deficits fuel inflation. They are the ones paying the price at the grocery store. Food inflation is 70% higher than the target.

Instead of bullying the Parliamentary Budget Officer by constantly reminding him that his appointment is only temporary or pointing out how many days he has left until his term of office ends, will the Prime Minister admit that doubling the deficit without any fiscal anchors will raise inflation and punish families?